The lot of you that choose to argue and insult those that wish to use
appended disclaimers/footers are merely wasting peoples time.
The fact of the matter is that companies do use disclaimers/footers, and it
was a simple question regarding if it was possible with Exim.
The thread is not a debate on whether or not to use them, just a how-to
question.
Many major mail software companies provide disclaimer/footer ability:
http://www.atmail.com
E-mail disclaimer do also reduce a degree of liability by proving a company
has acted responsibly:
#Whatare
Please do not argue about whether or not you disagree with companies using
disclaimers/footers, that is and was not the point of my initial post.
This list should be used for technical assistance and help in accomplishing
tasks with Exim, not to engage in childish debates.
I of course saw the listed method on Exim's site, but thought someone would
know of an easier or better way to customize it even further.
I've not instead purchased the Exim official book to try and find some help
seeing that people on this list are focussed more in insults than
assistance.
Thanks.

>From: "Greg A. Woods" <woods (AT) weird (DOT) com>
>Reply-To: "Greg A. Woods" <woods (AT) weird (DOT) com>
>To: ".|MoNK|Cucumber ." <realcucumber (AT) hotmail (DOT) com>
>Subject: Re: [exim] Easy Disclaimers with Exim?
>Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 17:30:48 -0400 (EDT)
>MIME-Version: 1.0
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>References:
><E1DqKdy-000DXI-VU (AT) sesame (DOT) csx.cam.ac.uk><@phx.gbl>
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>: Planix, Inc.; Toronto, ; Canada
>Return-Path: woods (AT) building (DOT) weird.com
>XArrivalTime: 12 Jul 2005 21:30:53.0383 (UTC)
>FILETIME=[FB42D570:01C58728]
>
>[ Thursday, July 7, 2005 at 00:04:15 (-0700), .|MoNK|Cucumber . wrote: ]
Subject: [exim] Easy Disclaimers with Exim?
According to Exim's site, it is difficult and not recommended to use
disclaimers.
However, most companies still require it, as it at least serves as some
>form
of disclaimer in case of error.
>
>Then most companies must have management that can't follow more than two
>logical consecutive steps in a simple thought process.
>
>Show your management my anti-disclaimer disclaimer:
>

>Greg A. Woods
>
>H:+1 416 218-0098 W:+1 416 489-5852 x122 VE3TCP RoboHack
><woods (AT) robohack (DOT) ca>
>Planix, Inc. <woods (AT) planix (DOT) comSecrets of the Weird
><woods (AT) weird (DOT) com>
>
>
>This e-mail puts you on notice that I will not be bound by your
>confidentiality notice and will feel free to review, disclose,
>distribute, archive, laugh at, be amused by, poke fun publicly at,
>and/or publish anything I get in e-mail, either directly or indirectly,
>and whether intended for me or not, without any further notice. If you
>don't feel comfortable with that, I suggest that you not send any
>e-mail, especially not to me or any mailing list I might subscribe to;
>or at least that you always use strong digital encryption to ensure that
>your e-mail can't be read by anyone other than its intended
>recipient(s). There are many ways to do this, including using such
>widely available tools as PGP, GPG, or even S/Mime.
>
>So in fact what you have done by adding such a lame and powerless
>disclaimer is to say in effect "We are adding this disclaimer because we
>acknowledge we are not taking sufficient measures to properly and truly
>protect our e-mail traffic by using encryption tools as we should be
>doing"
>
>I apologize to you if it was not your decision to add this notice to
>your e-mail. However, given the number of places that have legalized
>shrink wrap licenses and the similarity of your notice to same, I feel
>like it is incumbent on me to put you and your company on notice
>immediately regarding my rejection of your disclaimer. Please forward
>this message to whoever in your legal department or management chain you
>deem as appropriate.
>
>
>EULA - [ All rights to the preceeding communication are fully retained by
>the author, the non-exclusive right to read and/or reproduce the preceeding
>text is hereby licensed to the public, subject to the following conditions:
>(a) Scope of Use: No person may read the preceeding text without first
>agreeing to be bound by these conditions. Reading, perusing, scanning or
>otherwise viewing or percieving the preceeding text whether by visual,
>auditory, olfactory, gustatory or tactile manner constitutes agreement to
>these terms. (b) Fair Use of Material: license is granted for fair use
>of
>the preceeding material, including but not limited to reproduction in whole
>or in part, quoted or unquoted, so long at that use does not annoy, offend,
>irk, distress, disturb, bother, harry or otherwise taunt, tease, belittle,
>libel, slander, critisize, contradict, dispute, demean or cause to be so
>the
>author of the preceeding work. (c) Limitation of No : No person
>reading or otherwise consuming in any way such as (but not limited to)
>those
>methods described in part (a) is permitted to be offended, annoyed, irked,
>distressed, disturbed, bothered, or harried by the preceeding text. If the
>preceding text would do so, the license for it's use is pre-emptorily
>withdrawn and voided prior to it's reading. (d) Waiver of Recourse: the
>Licensee or Potential Licensee agrees prior to acceptance of this agreement
>to hold harmless and indemnify the author against any claim, civil or
>legal,
>which might arise from the perusal of the preceeding material. (e)
>Severability: The invalidation of any part of this license agreement shall
>in no way void the whole or affect the application of any other part of
>this
>agreement. (f) Sense of Humor: Any potential reader without a sense of
>humor is referred to parts (c) and (d) of this agreement and requested to
>note that the lack thereof is disqualified as mitigation of any of these
>terms. ]
>
>If you and/or your PHB still think your mailer should automatically
>attach a stupid disclaimer like this one to all your outgoing e-mail
>then please also read this:
>
><>

".|MoNK|Cucumber ." wrote:

The lot of you that choose to argue and insult those that wish to use
appended disclaimers/footers are merely wasting peoples time.
The fact of the matter is that companies do use disclaimers/footers, and
it was a simple question regarding if it was possible with Exim.
The thread is not a debate on whether or not to use them, just a how-to
question.

The point that you and many others have missed is that it is not an MTA's
job to modify a messages content, that is the job of the MUA. an
MUA can properly (or improperly) create the content of the message,
especially when proper (proper in this case being the sender has thier
own key to sign with, and a global site key is not used) encryption
techniques are used.

Now, for those that like to nit-pick, yes, an MTA can at times be used for
more than just the transfering of messages as the MTA has recieved them,
but nearly (not including any message headers that get added for different
reasons) all of those cases are explicitely designed to enusre that a
message is compatable for the public SMTP infrastucture, and even at that,
the portion of the MTA, or any other 'agent' in between, is not really
acting as an MTA, but at that moment, it is working as a bridge-head to
different messageing topologies.

This is how nearly all 'group-ware' products such as MS exchnage, Lotus
Notes, Novell Groupwise, etc. work. They are not MTA only products.

Exim (for nearly all installations) is just an MTA, it can be used as an
MUA transport to interject email to an MTA, but then again, Exim has
special settings and restrictions that can and should be used for this
purpose.

What you have been getting upset about is you want people to show you
what many have already said is possible, to add a footer/disclaimer, to
a message when Exim is running the message through its routers or
transports, this is not a trivial task, there is no 'easy' way to do this.

Even when it comes to any product that you may want to say does this, it
may be an 'easy' task for you to configure, but inside the program, it is
not an easy task.

As to your wanting to have a specific 'font' for the disclaimer, you seem
to have completely missed the point. SMTP message are ASCII TEXT BASED.
There is no particular 'font' that you can force any recipient of a message
to use. That is what MIME parts with HTML, or RichText are for, but now,
you get into even more complications as you are going to have to
encapsulate a message in MIME when it never had any MIME parts at all, or
add a MIME part to a message that is possibly already very complex in its
MIME structure. Not impossible, but not easy.

Also, doing such things at the transport level rather than the client MUA
level, you must consider what you are going to do with digitally signed
messages. Are you going to force them to be unpacked and then resigned?
Are you going to try and encapsulate the entire signed message within
another message that may or may not be signed? There are other
considerations, but this should be a start.

Whether disclaimers should or should not be used, or to how much legal
gain or loss there may be is rather irrelavent I do agree. The fact of
the matter is that there is no case law that I am currently aware of that
has ever given such things any real sense of being usefull. As long as
you are broadcasting the message content in a non-encrypted form, which
is how the message is going to be sent unless it has been encrypted
directly after creation, then anyone who has a basic network sniffer can
grab the information (legal issues may apply there as to being 'authorized'
or not) but as a point, the message can be posted, or reposted by anyone.

Disclaimers are no more a legal protection for anyone than it would be
in giving a Terms of Service, or EULA AFTER a product has been installed
rather than before it has been installed.

but i will digress now

[snip]

".|MoNK|Cucumber .",

|MoNK|Cucumber . ecrit:
The lot of you that choose to argue and insult those that wish to use
appended disclaimers/footers are merely wasting peoples time.

There were a couple of friendly replies to your question, despite
the fact that this discussion has been held a couple of times before
and information regarding how to do what you intend to do can be
found in the list archives.

There were also others who prefered to point out that there are many
serious drawbacks with disclaimers in many aspects.

So both parties spent time and effort to send you information that's
related to your question.

The fact of the matter is that companies do use disclaimers/footers, and
it was a simple question regarding if it was possible with Exim.

Another matter of fact is that on this planet there are people
killing other people

The thread is not a debate on whether or not to use them, just a how-to
question.

Well, if you need step-by-step assistance, you should read about how
disclaimers can be added in places you were pointed to. If you get
stuck in applying your disclaimer configuration I'm sure folks will
support you as soon as you post an exact problem.

To expect that someone on this list will tell you in detail how to
accomplish s/th that is considered as "questionable" for good reason
is somewhat naive.

Please do not argue about whether or not you disagree with companies
using disclaimers/footers, that is and was not the point of my initial
post.
This list should be used for technical assistance and help in
accomplishing tasks with Exim, not to engage in childish debates.

You did not ask for technical assistance so far. You were asking for
technical help. There's a difference.

I of course saw the listed method on Exim's site, but thought someone
would know of an easier or better way to customize it even further.

There is no easy way in mangling/demangling email bodies.

I've not instead purchased the Exim official book to try and find some
help seeing that people on this list are focussed more in insults than
assistance.

You were given a lot of valuable tips. Both mail-related as well as
of a more general nature. Let me put it this way: Drop some sloppy
coolness, sit down and start learning how email disclaimers can be
added. Come back if you're stuck. People on this list will then most
probably respect and support you.

Sorry if the some of the above may sound offending - it's certainly
not meant that way.

Kind regards
vt

Please note that this list does not exist to instantly provide you with
free consultancy. If that is a problem you are welcome to unsubscribe.
If you want to argue the point remember that list barring is always a
possibility.

* .|MoNK|Cucumber . wrote (07/13/05 06:39):
The lot of you that choose to argue and insult those that wish to use
appended disclaimers/footers are merely wasting peoples time.

The fact of the matter is that companies do use disclaimers/footers, and it
was a simple question regarding if it was possible with Exim.

The thread is not a debate on whether or not to use them, just a how-to
question.

[]

Here's another how-to question:

I want to send mail to a list of addresses harvested from the Internet.
I want the mail get low SpamAssassin scores, and I want to avoid being
plagued by non-delivery reports from other people's systems. If I can
redirect the non-delivery reports to other people, that would be ideal.
I want to send this mail 24 hours a day using my entire available
bandwidth. I don't want any of the mail to be traced back to me. How can
I best do this using Exim?

Please do not argue about whether or not you disagree with companies using
disclaimers/footers, that is and was not the point of my initial post.

Quite.

This list should be used for technical assistance and help in accomplishing
tasks with Exim, not to engage in childish debates.

[]

I'm really looking forward to the technical assistance I'm going to get
with my problem.

[K, I agree - this isn't really a fair comparison]

Tue, Jul 12, 2005 at 10:39:19PM -0700, .|MoNK|Cucumber . wrote:
The lot of you that choose to argue and insult those that wish to use
appended disclaimers/footers are merely wasting peoples time.

The fact of the matter is that companies do use disclaimers/footers, and it
was a simple question regarding if it was possible with Exim.

The thread is not a debate on whether or not to use them, just a how-to
question.

I had to do this recently as part of an investigation into the
technicalities of disclaimers in our setup.

In / I have

smarthost:
debug_print = "R: smarthost for $local_part@$domain"
driver = manualroute
domains = ! +local_domains
transport = remote_smtp_smarthost
# transport = ${if eq {$sender_address_domain}{sun.ac.za}\
# {remote_smtp_filter}{remote_smtp}}
route_list = * DCsmarthost byname
host_find_failed = defer
same_domain_copy_routing = yes
no_more

To use the disclaimer, I uncomment the two commented lines and comment
the one above it: transport = remote_smtp_smarthost

I then created a file:
/
which contains:

remote_smtp_filter:
#driver = pipe
driver = smtp
transport_filter = "/usr/local/bin/disclaimer"

The file /usr/local/bin/disclaimer was compiled from the attached
sources. You should edit the functions "disclaimer" and
"disclaimer-header" to suit you situation.

You need to compile the sources and use "make" to create a
bytecode-compiled program or "make nc" to compile a native-code
program.

Regards
Johann

Wed, 2005-07-13 at 09:41 +0100, Chris Lear wrote:
Here's another how-to question:

I want to send mail to a list of addresses harvested from the Internet.
I want the mail get low SpamAssassin scores, and I want to avoid being
plagued by non-delivery reports from other people's systems. If I can
redirect the non-delivery reports to other people, that would be ideal.
I want to send this mail 24 hours a day using my entire available
bandwidth. I don't want any of the mail to be traced back to me. How can
I best do this using Exim?

I think it's best if we do some in person consultancy, preferably using
the "clue-by-four" attention grabbing method.

, and if no one guessed

:)

The lot of you that choose to argue and insult those that wish to use
appended disclaimers/footers are merely wasting peoples time.

The fact of the matter is that companies do use disclaimers/footers, and it
was a simple question regarding if it was possible with Exim.

The thread is not a debate on whether or not to use them, just a how-to
question.

Many major mail software companies provide disclaimer/footer ability:

http://www.atmail.com

E-mail disclaimer do also reduce a degree of liability by proving a company
has acted responsibly:
#Whatare

Please do not argue about whether or not you disagree with companies using
disclaimers/footers, that is and was not the point of my initial post.

This list should be used for technical assistance and help in accomplishing
tasks with Exim, not to engage in childish debates.

I of course saw the listed method on Exim's site, but thought someone would
know of an easier or better way to customize it even further.

I've not instead purchased the Exim official book to try and find some help
seeing that people on this list are focussed more in insults than
assistance.

and thank you for such an excellend example thereof

randy

[ Tuesday, July 12, 2005 at 22:39:19 (-0700), .|MoNK|Cucumber . wrote: ]
Subject: FW: Re: [exim] Easy Disclaimers with Exim?
>
>From: "Greg A. Woods" <woods (AT) weird (DOT) com>
>Reply-To: "Greg A. Woods" <woods (AT) weird (DOT) com>
>To: ".|MoNK|Cucumber ." <realcucumber (AT) hotmail (DOT) com>
>Subject: Re: [exim] Easy Disclaimers with Exim?

There goes another one of you guys posting private mail to the list.

* .|MoNK|Cucumber . <realcucumber (AT) hotmail (DOT) com[20050713 08:41]: wrote:
The lot of you that choose to argue and insult those that wish to use
appended disclaimers/footers are merely wasting peoples time.

I beg to disagree. There were so many who gave positive advise, but
there are also those that were unwittingly invited to give insults
by the P. I was particularly 'enlightened' by Philip's (Hazel) pose:

"why some organizations are so keen on e-mail disclaimers while they
do not have such on normal paper correspondence" (rephrased of course).

Initially, noone hurled epithets, but later, they seemed to come up
so easily. I will tell you one thing, and never add or remove any letter
from this text: "E-mail disclaimer texts equates to 3rd world war on
exim-users list". You better keep off it.
)

The fact of the matter is that companies do use disclaimers/footers, and it
was a simple question regarding if it was possible with Exim.

"If is was simple, or how to do it"?

Both questions were answered pretty exhaustively. You mean you never
got the point at all?

The thread is not a debate on whether or not to use them, just a how-to
question.

and there were lots of suggestions. I remember one by Tim Jackson.

Many major mail software companies provide disclaimer/footer ability:

http://www.atmail.com

It depends on how they do it. I run @Mail (www.atmail.com) and it really
does "not" provide disclaimer per se. It adds footers to any mail sent
using the web interface. Try sending e-mail through it using SMTP and
see if you get the same. BTW, @Mail uses Exim as the SMTP server, if
you did not know it.

E-mail disclaimer do also reduce a degree of liability by proving a company
has acted responsibly:
#Whatare

Please do not argue about whether or not you disagree with companies using
disclaimers/footers, that is and was not the point of my initial post.

I have some scripts that I was supposed to test out adding disclaimers
with. Matt (I'll not mention his second name lest they set Al Qaeda
after him) helped me alot with them. I haven't yet given him my report
because I still have a glitch with how to run the transport filter. I'm
still scared, to be sincere ;)

If you have the will, talk to me off list. I will not in anyway stand
the war about "stupid disclaimers" - I am not strong enough. Period.

This list should be used for technical assistance and help in accomplishing
tasks with Exim, not to engage in childish debates.

But noone is under any obligation to assist. You better know that. In
fact, all these people know the "purpose" of this list. Make no mistake.

I of course saw the listed method on Exim's site, but thought someone would
know of an easier or better way to customize it even further.

E-mail is so complicated. There is no easier way, otherwise Philip could
have retired from developing Exim long ago. It's that difficulty and the
ever changing needs that has kept him on his toes, besides other
factors, of course. Thanks Philip!! We can never than you enough for
Exim.

I've not instead purchased the Exim official book to try and find some help
seeing that people on this list are focussed more in insults than
assistance.

Whose problem is that though? I am sure these people feel nothing. I
have the book though, but not everything is written in the book

never rant back at these people. They feel nothing. At the end of the
day, it's you who has a problem to solve. No amount of ranting will give
you a solution.

Again, please contact me off list if you are still interested in testing
the scripts that I have.

cheers
- wash

Washington . WANANCHI NLINE LTD (Nairobi, KE) |
wash () WANANCHI ! com. 1ere Etage, Loita Hse, Loita St., |
GSM: (+254) 722 743 223. # 10286, 00100 NAIRBI |
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" My God! They killed init! You Bastards!"
a /. post