Recently I needed to change my password, and in trying to recall the
name of the pkg (apg) that generated good passwords, the first place
I looked was "man passwd" which of course didn't have a reference to
this pkg. Eventually a friend pointed me back to apg. Anyway I'm
wondering if this reference:
Pa pkgsrc/security/apg
thus:
SEE ALS
chpass(1), login(1), passwd(5), passwd.conf(5), pam(8), pwd_mkdb
(8),
vipw(8), pkgsrc/security/apg
would be worthwhile addition to the passwd.1 manpage.
Chris.

2005.12.18 18:50:26 -0800, Christian Hopps wrote:
| Recently I needed to change my password, and in trying to recall the
| name of the pkg (apg) that generated good passwords, the first place
| I looked was "man passwd" which of course didn't have a reference to
| this pkg. Eventually a friend pointed me back to apg. Anyway I'm
| wondering if this reference:
|
| .Pa pkgsrc/security/apg
|
| thus:
|
| SEE ALS
| chpass(1), login(1), passwd(5), passwd.conf(5), pam(8), pwd_mkdb
| (8),
| vipw(8), pkgsrc/security/apg
|
| would be worthwhile addition to the passwd.1 manpage.

Yes, I think so.
-- Rui Paulo

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Hi,

do we really want to add such 'external' references to the manpages?
And if so, where do we start an stop doing it?

Bernd

Mon, Dec 19, 2005 at 01:45:01PM +0000, Rui Paulo wrote:
2005.12.18 18:50:26 -0800, Christian Hopps wrote:
| Recently I needed to change my password, and in trying to recall the
| name of the pkg (apg) that generated good passwords, the first place
| I looked was "man passwd" which of course didn't have a reference to
| this pkg. Eventually a friend pointed me back to apg. Anyway I'm
| wondering if this reference:
|
| .Pa pkgsrc/security/apg
|
| thus:
|
| SEE ALS
| chpass(1), login(1), passwd(5), passwd.conf(5), pam(8), pwd_mkdb
| (8),
| vipw(8), pkgsrc/security/apg
|
| would be worthwhile addition to the passwd.1 manpage.

Yes, I think so.
-- Rui Paulo

Tue, Dec 20, 2005 at 06:25:35PM +0100, Bernd Ernesti wrote:
do we really want to add such 'external' references to the manpages?
And if so, where do we start an stop doing it?

We have already started, see bktr(4).
However, I think that's kind of a special case, and I'm not sure
we want to add more in this vein.

Why should we suggest only one one package for generating passwords?
There are probably quite a number of them.
Thomas

2005.12.20 10:33:32 -0700, Tim Rightnour wrote:
|
| 20-Dec-2005 Bernd Ernesti wrote:
| do we really want to add such 'external' references to the manpages?
| And if so, where do we start an stop doing it?
|
| The external reference doesn't bother me as much as the wording of it. It just
| doesn't look right having "pkgsrc/foo/blah" in there
|
| Maybe a separate section for pkgsrc references, or a special coding for the man
| chapter, like pkgsrc-1 or something I dunno

Why ? We already do that. Check iwictl(8), ipwctl(8), compat_linux(8),
compat_darwin(8), etc
-- Rui Paulo

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Let's only point to pkgsrc to help for specific needs, such as firmware
and compat libraries.

(By the way, back to the original example, I just use tools provided with
system to generate random passwords and hashes.)

Jeremy C. Reed

BSD News, BSD tutorials, BSD links
http://www.bsdnewsletter.com/

2005.12.20 18:25:35 +0100, Bernd Ernesti wrote:
| Hi,
|
| do we really want to add such 'external' references to the manpages?

Why not ? It makes the user experience less painful.

| And if so, where do we start an stop doing it?

Place yourself in user-mode and decide if having an external reference
on a specific man page helps you or not.
-- Rui Paulo

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Tue, 20 Dec 2005, Rui Paulo wrote:
| And if so, where do we start an stop doing it?

Place yourself in user-mode and decide if having an external reference
on a specific man page helps you or not.

That depends on the user i'm putting myself in.
Some would want KDE & whatnot

I guess I'll repeat my "no bloat" & "keep the base system
consistent" mantras here. :)

- Hubert

Dec 20, 2005, at 8:43 PM, Hubert Feyrer wrote:

Tue, 20 Dec 2005, Rui Paulo wrote:
>| And if so, where do we start an stop doing it?
>>
>Place yourself in user-mode and decide if having an external
>reference
>on a specific man page helps you or not.
>
That depends on the user i'm putting myself in.
Some would want KDE & whatnot

I guess I'll repeat my "no bloat" & "keep the base system
consistent" mantras here. :)

This can't seriously be considered bloat.

As Rui mentions the entire point is to help the user out.

I believe that most people who might object to this really are
objecting to the external reference in general, perhaps it feels
"untidy" or something. Someone else alluded to a slippery slope,
asking where is the line drawn. What I keep coming back to is the
question: in what way is the system negatively impacted by adding
references to related programs we supply through pkgsrc? Why are we
drawing any line and what slippery slope are we exactly afraid of?

If there exist netbsd packages that relate to some feature in the
base system why not add references to them in the system
documentation? To me the value add is clear, unclear though is what
negative impact adding them would cause.

Chris.

--
- Hubert